Casting Directors: You’re Supposed to Move ME, Not Yourself

This is just one example of sage advice offered by a panel of casting directors yesterday at the FIN (Film Industry Network) session at Sony. The panel consisted of MAUREEN BROWNE (casting executive for E! Entertainment Television), BILLY DEMOTA (casting director for independent features), IVY ISENBERG (casting associate for MGM Television and their shows like Stargate, Dead Like Me, and Jeremiah), PAUL RUDDY (casting director from Fern Champion Casting), and RICK PAGANO (casting director for 24) who upon entering quipped, "Nobody understands pain like Jack Bauer."

After all, if I'm going to put my headshots to good use, I should learn more about this end of the business. And before I go any farther, I should introduce the people in the photos.

In the first picture to the left, you have Billy, Maureen, and Rick. In the second picture to the right, you have Maureen, Ivy, Rick, and Paul.

To expand a bit more on our panelists' history: Maureen Browne's current interest is in casting hosts for the Style Network, The Vine at E! Online, and E! International. She has helped cast Joel McHale on The Soup, the cast of The Daily 10, E! News, and Clean House. When she's not casting for E! shows, she's teaching monthly classes on hosting to help people break into that area of television.

Billy DaMota worked in the Bay Area's entertainment industry in the early '70s. Since then, he's cast for notable directors such as Andrew Davis, Jonathan Kaplan, John Landis, and Dennis Hopper, and actors such as Ed Harris, Sean Penn, Brad Pitt, Cameron Diaz, Martin Sheen, Tony Curtis, and Mickey Rooney. He wrote a screenplay and produced it as a film with the late Timothy Leary. In 1989, he started casting commercial and music video and established a working relationship with director Russell Mulcahy. On staff at Lee Strasberg Institute in Hollywood, Billy teaches actors audition techniques.

Ivy Isenberg started in development for an independent film production company, and then she represented writers and managed actors. Prior to starting her own company, she served as in-house casting associate for MGM Television and was responsible for finding actors for 95% of the television shows that MGM produced.

Paul Ruddy and Fern Champion cast over a dozen movies for TV and independent features and are cuurently casting the feature Christmas in Wonderland. He and Fern have cast for Lifetime and SciFi Channel, including the pilot for Painkiller Jane.

Rick Pagano and Peggy Kennedy not only cast series like 24 and Millenium, but also films like X-Men-3 (aka X-Men: The Last Stand), Sky Captain and the World of Tomorrow, and Hotel Rwanda. There are more facets to Rick than just a casting director, he's also an actor, producer, writer, and director.

Ivy assured us that "We're both on the same team. We're not the enemy. I can only do my job when you are the best you can be. Every day I pray for amazing people. Don't be intimidated by casting directors. We're here to give you jobs. We're here to activate your dreams."

Paul echoed Ivy's words. "We're on your side. Everyone in the waiting room is nervous. Some actors hide it better. We're not the enemy. The producers are." This brought a chuckle out of the audience.

As a way to realize that dream, one audience member asked if casting directors worked with envelopes (meaning headshots sent through the mail) or just worked with the on-line breakdown services. Billy explained that he didn't work with envelopes because on-line sources are so much more convenient for him to categorize and sort, just like using a datebase spreadsheet. "I can filter what I do and don't want. It's great to not have to throw away thousands of photos at the end of a project... for our trees and environment."

The major breakdown services are: Actors Access Breakdown Services, LA Casting, Breakneck Express Breakdown, and Now Casting. Breakdown services send to agents as well, but at least 1/3 of everything Billy has cast has come from Actors Access.

Ivy loves online services because it's amazing how fast she can go through reels, like in 30 seconds. She cautioned though that she tries not to look at reels so she can have a life. But if available, she'll watch 15 seconds to get a sense of who the actor is. "Not that hippie skippy," she said, agreeing with Billy, "but you got to do something for the environment."

Rick said he used both and reassured the actors in the audience that casting directors don't care how you get to them; they want the best actor for the role. Ivy jumped in to caution that "if you do drop off, just drop off and leave. Don't kibbutz with the staff." Otherwise they won't have time to get you work.

Rick agreed that actors should "respect our time," but he reminds, "Your job is to get work." Hence, if you drop off pic and resume, they aren't going to remember how it came in. "Leave the building quickly after the audition, and leave slowly," was his advice. I think he saw the blank stares for that remark so he told a story to illustrate why this is important. When casting Chicago Hope, their session was falling apart. it was 6:30 and they hadn't found the actors. A messenger came to drop off more submissions and Debbie called out, "Stop!" to him, then asked, "You ever done any acting?" According to Rick, you can never know what might happen.

Billy concurred with both Rick and Ivy. He doesn't mind if an actor drops off a headshot in person just as long as it's done fast. "It's okay to say, 'I was in the area and wanted to drop this off. Call me if you have something for me.'" He agreed with Rick that you should then leave the office quickly, but the building slowly to give the casting director time to connect your headshot with a role they are casting. Sometimes the assistant will run out to the curb to give you sides.

Maureen said she needs different kinds of people for different things. For example, for Live from the Red Carpet, she needs a journalist. So for her, looking at actors' demos for about the first 15-30 seconds can be helpful, since hosting is all about personality and being on your toes. She added that she thought headshot postcards are amazing. She loves them because she doesn't need to open them up. She can go through a batch while she's on the phone.

Another important subject on actors' minds was how the panel felt about general auditions. Ivy indicated she does do them, but ultimately she cares little about an actor's personality. "I need to know if you can do it in the room and who's right for the role. Actors get offended if you don't spend more than 15 minutes with them."

On the other hand, Paul indicated that he also does them and cited that it's a good way to get to know actors' personalities, but he generally only does them with referrals from agents he trusts. The better way for him is to participate in workshops. He feels that's a great way to get to know new entries into the business.

Because Maureen works in hosting, personality is everything, so she'll do two generals a month just to see what the actors are like.

Since the audience consisted of writers as well as actors, another big question concerned when to bring a casting director onto a project. "Plenty of casting directors will do a project out of love for it," Ivy said, "but you first need money for the project. Be fair to them because if they are mortgaging their reputations with actors, please see to it that you have the money for the project to pay the actors." She explained that producers must consider what's in it for the actor to do their projects when he/she is getting millions to do fully funded studio projects?

Billy was more hard-line, saying the time to call in the casting director is when you are fully funded. If you are not fully-funded, then maybe a casting coordinator or assistant might be willing to take on the project. Rick then reminded us that this month's assistant is next month's casting director, so assistants have a vested interest in finding people to champion.

Rick admitted it can be a catch-22. "If you only have 1 million dollars," he cautioned, "don't try to get Tom Cruise." Try for actors close to the same level as your budget. As an example, he said that when Halle Berry and Billy Bob Thornton did Monsters Ball, they weren't big names at the time.

Rick went on to say that if as a writer, all you have is a script to go to them with, then you haven't done your homework. you haven't done the legwork to pull together a package and to get at least partial financing. Soft money can be had from states like New Mexico. Rick also said you can offer an actor a 'pay or play' deal where you put the money in escrow which gives a reasonable expectation of happening for credibility. If your movie goes down, then the actor still gets paid.

Another good inquiry was about actors asking questions of the casting director in the audition. Billy cautioned actors to do the work before they come in. "It's a big mistake to ask -- 'How do you see the role? What do you want me to do?' Do your thing. We'll tell you if we want an adjustment."

Maureen reiterated the same advice: "Just go and do it. If I need to do an adjustment, I'll tell you." Rick elaborated that he wanted smart questions, not questions that show the actor hasn't done his homework. "It's different if you have looked over the role and see it more than one way, and then ask: 'do you want this more sexy or less sexy?'"

Paul picked up that ball and elaborated, "Do not ask intelligent questions during the callback, do that during the pre-read. If you are called back, stick to what you did the first time-- that's what got you the callback. Don't change it unless we tell you to do so, because if we've been talking excitedly to the director and if that isn't what he sees, we're gonna look bad."

Paul said an actor should be watching TV and looking at co-star roles and guest star roles in order to target shows he thinks he might be right for. Then look for panels or workshops that the casting directors might be doing. The business is so competitive that anything that can make an actor stand out is a good thing. As long as it isn't bizarre behavior. He gave an example of an actor thinking himself clever to send something that looked like an official document, saying 'urgent, open immediately,' when inside was the message, 'ha, ha, made you open this.'

Maureen concurred with Paul. "Know if you are the sexpot or the best friend. Be who you are." She also said the casting directors may be thinking of you all the time, even if they aren't bringing you in. That so many times, after so much work, she books someone and there isn't even a thank you.

This brought up the topic of appropriate thank yous. Ivy claimed to only need a thank you, not food, to which Billy replied, "I want food." (This was interesting for me when my office on a show was right next door to the casting director's. She got flowers every week it seemed and cookies, candy, fruit. I got to the point where I'd rate them so I would know which were the better places to buy from when I needed thank yous. In fact, she once got an arrangement of "flowers" made from shortbread cookies which were wonderful. I have used Cookies by Design ever since because they will customize those cookies into whatever shapes you want and you can customize your thank you to the people involved. Not at all cheap, but very impressive, if they go to someone you want to impress -- for example, I've had aliens and baseball team bears done.)

Ivy went on to say that she wants to get thank you flowers from series regulars she's placed.

On that note, Paul revealed that Cameron Diaz sends Christmas cards to Fern every year since Fern gave Cameron her first break.

Ever loquacious and bubbly, Ivy went on the chastise actors, saying "most actors here are f*cking lazy -- being in the Arts is a privilege and a blessing and ony the best are allowed in. Be realistic about your type," she echoed Maureen, then continued with, "Look at an audition as a 5-minute opportunity. If nothing else happens, you should consider that you got to act for 5 minutes. You should be doing it because you get a chance to move people. You're not doing it well unless you're exhausted or spent afterwards -- from giving a bit of your spirit and soul to us. What we want is the talent that shows off the brilliance of your soul and spirit. Anything else is masturbation and I don't want to see it." The latter comment brought unexpected laughter from both audience and panel. She ended her impassioned speech with the sage advice, "You're supposed to move me, not yourself."

Asked to share some of their 'don'ts,' Paul mentioned that his pet peeve was actors who don't watch TV. He thinks that they should get out of the business. (I have the same thoughts, but not about just actors. In my film and TV career, I've met many people who don't watch TV -- can't even recognize the actors on the shows that are essentially paying their salaries.)

One of Ivy's pet peeves is an actor who doesn't bring a bottle of water with him. Having her assistant get water wastes time and is annoying. She also cautioned against licking your thumb in the middle of a session. This sounds pretty odd, unless she was kidding. She also warned, "Don't shake hands, don't touch me."

Maureen contributed to the don'ts with, "If your hair is in your eyes, fix it beforehand, because otherwise the execs will focus on that and nothing more."

Paul said that sometimes personality can be the killer, for if the producer/director gets the feeling that an actor is going to be high maintenance, he may not hire. Once he was casting a hunter scene. An actor came in and went through a whole cutting through the jungle scenario first before he got started. The actor gave a good audition but the director said, "I'm shooting in 16 days. I don't have time to go through this every scene."

Ivy agreed. "Don't do the backstory," she advised. "First do the lines and be good with the material given. Our job is to find people on the same page creatively with the director and network execs. Your job is to know the show's style -- what they are looking for."

And speaking of what they are looking for... With his experience at casting independent MOWs and Lifetime women-in-peril movies, Paul revealed that Lifetime is trying to get away from women-in-peril movies. They now want to have movies where women are placing themselves in peril, such as having dangerous jobs like firefighting.

Looking over how long this is, I'd say we got a lot of useful information from these fine guests. The session ended with this final piece of advice from Billy: "Be the best human being you can be."